1. Prof Andrew Pask on becoming "The Thylacine Guy" and raising $40M
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Episode show notes
Today's episode is a deep dive with Prof Andrew Pask — the thylacine guy. He's head of the TIGRR lab at the University of Melbourne, and he's already raised around $40 million to support his lab's work to de extinct the thylacine.
As you'll hear, he's incredibly passionate about conducting comms and engagement and our conversation touches on everything from how his side hustle turned into a $40M research endeavour, to dealing with criticism and when things go wrong, and the importance of community engagement.
It's a great conversation, so enjoy and stay tuned for next week's episode with A/Prof Jen Martin. We'll be releasing weekly for the first 12 episodes, and then switching to every other week to give us a bit more time to release some of the other exciting Amplifying Research projects we have in store for you.
Our conversation covers:
Fundraising
The side hustle phase
Balancing faith and realistic expectations
The first philanthropic donation as an inflection point
Being a key person of influence when there have been others before you
Sci comms via influencers?
Dealing with criticism
Media training
When things go wrong
Community engagement
Broadening the voice
Resources Mentioned:
"How to Clone a Mammoth" — https://press.princeton.edu/books/paperback/9780691209005/how-to-clone-a-mammoth
- Public engagement
- Career development
- Team alignment
- Storytelling
- Your pitch
- Listening
- Mentorship
- Collaborating with professional staff
- Communicating in different formats/mediums
- Comedy
- Failure
- Stakeholder/audience mapping
- Philanthropic funding
- Relationship management
- Community engagement
- Making your work relatable
- Feedback
Quotes:
"And I think it was just getting my name out there that people could see that I was the person to talk to..."
"But the most transformative publications across my career have been related to that topic, but I was never able to directly fund that topic. So when I talk to people about career path and stuff, I'm like. I think there's real validity in following still those passion projects when you can and just keep on, there's something you really care about, just keep on pushing those goals whenever you can and then, you know, I realize that I am an incredibly lucky and fortunate scientist to have the support that I have. So I don't, by all means think this is going to happen for everyone, but I think there are chances with some of these topics that that can really pay off in the long run..."
"And I think through all the science comms that I have really seen over the last five years, it's actually blown my mind now that when I go to America and I talk about it, people actually know what the animal is from the work that I've done, Colossal have done. And I think that is incredible to me that I go, I can't believe that people know this animal now, but it has become an icon for the extinction biology. You know, it's been in lots of popular press, lots of, you know, media surrounding it. And I think, yeah, it's incredible to think. That there has been that shift that people actually know it now."
"I really believe in educating the public about all of these issues. And I think it all just builds and adds to more and more opportunities, more people reaching out. You know, you do a podcast like this and other people listen to it and they're like, actually, I'd love you to come and talk at a forum that we're putting together about how to attract funding for science or whatever. Like every single opportunity I think you take. It leads to more connections, more opportunities to do more. So I encourage people, don't wait for the university contact you or to have somebody else say, Hey, here's an opportunity... But I think you have to actively go out and look to drive that."
"I think, you know, there is certainly an audience that you reach in a breadth of audience that you reach... through engaging, you know, celebrities and influencers and things that is not possible within the realm of a mere nerdy scientist as myself, trying to tweet something or, you know, posting something on LinkedIn. It just doesn't have the same gravitas, of people just going, Oh, that's interesting. And then taking the time then to read about the research and what it actually means."
"I think a lot of, you know, what I do is when I go in there is really about trying to dispel myths. I think one of the ways that I've really worked hard on this for the science comms perspective is I spend a lot of time really trying to understand what people's concerns are."
"And I think, you know, that if you then get the traction for that and the funding to do that work, that's where we then can fund it into the less enigmatic species. Obviously all of those things get funded through driving something with, with a vision that people are really going to get behind and care about. So I think thinking about that too, like you said before, really thinking about your audience and how you're going to capture people's imagination. And then using that to do a greater good is really the way that things have to move."
"But I do believe if you're genuinely passionate about any topic that you work on, and you can contextualise that for why the public should care, that you can get that traction as well. It is harder. It's, I freely admit, it's very easy to get people excited about the Tassie Tiger, but , it's possible and I've done it for different topics."
"I think I was very late to the game in realising that there was always a motive and a story that the interviewer was wanting to tell. And that there are very easy ways to kind of shift that back into a space that you feel much more comfortable talking about. And having the confidence to say, that that's not the right way to frame the question. I think doing that is only through you having the training, feeling that confidence, and repeatedly doing it. And that's why I think getting engaged as early as possible in science comms is a great thing to do because you just start to build that confidence."
"I think a lot of things we get told in science all the time is don't take it personally, but we're so passionate about the topics that we work on. It's such a fundamental part of who we are. When you write a grant, when you put in papers, when you do this, when you're giving a talk, there's so much of who you are intrinsically as a person in any of those forums that it's impossible. So I always say, that's crazy when people say, don't take it personally. Of course you take it personally. It's completely normal to take all of these things personally, I think you just have to learn how you reconcile that in your own life and deal with that. "
